Cymene returns to the pod at long last (yay!) and we discuss recent events and how climate science probably caused wildfires and bears to happen. Then (13:17) Robert Savino Oventile joins the podcast to share his new collection of poems, The Canyon, the proceeds from which support the rebuilding of the Eaton Canyon Nature Center destroyed by the Eaton Fire and which for maximum positive synergy can be purchased from the wonderful Pasadena independent bookstore, Vroman’s (link here). In the conversation, Robert talks about his long relationship to Eaton Canyon and his experience during this January’s devastating Eaton Fire which destroyed thousands of structures in the Altadena area of Los Angeles. We talk about ecological relationality, symbiosis, and the influence of object-oriented ontology upon the project. We close with the importance of walking slowly and what folks can do to be better stewards of places like Eaton. If you want to learn more about the wonders of Eaton Canyon please look at the Tongva Taraxat Paxaavxa Conservancy and My Eaton Canyon, a website by and for Eaton Canyon enthusiasts put together by Edgar McGregor and Phil Hopkins.

Dominic reports from a delayed birthday trip to Los Angeles and we learn about how Mike Brady (of Brady Brunch fame) nearly perished in a helicopter crash. Then (5:55) Roy Scranton returns to the podcast after nearly eight years away. We’re talking about his provocative and important new book, Impasse: Climate Change and the Limits of Progress (Stanford UP, 2025). We begin with the philosophical origins of the concepts of optimism and pessimism in debates over Leibniz and Voltaire and from there explore what Roy means by “ethical pessimism.” Roy explains how pessimism might do more for us than the too-often empty rhetoric of hope and optimism because optimism verges toward narcissism and often defers relieving the suffering of the world into an imaginary future. From there we talk about signs of civilizational collapse (or “simplification”), the psychology of optimism, the virtues of depressive realism, pacifism and pessimism, religion and the apophatic tradition, and what comes after collapse. Listening to Roy may make you feel weirdly better about feeling hopeless these days. Finally (55:32) Cymene, Dominic and a nervous Brijzha take their first-ever trip in an automated Waymo vehicle and share a new song about Shadow (which can be found on Spotify here). Please listen and share! Hang in there, everyone, peace and love.

Dominic gives a quick update from the frontlines of home repair. Then (3:30) we welcome Rachel Frazin an energy and environmental reporter from The Hill to the podcast to talk about her new book, together with Sharon Udasin, Poisoning the Well: How Forever Chemicals Contaminated America (Island Press, 2025). We start with the basics: what forever chemicals and PFAS are, where they came from and when it first became clear that they could have devastating health impacts. We move from there to why, even though 97% of Americans have PFAS in their blood, Rachel sees this as a global problem and discuss some of the powerful and tragic personal stories covered in the book. We then talk about the failures of the regulatory state that allowed the PFAS epidemic to get so out of hand and various efforts to bring the originators of PFAS to justice. Finally, Rachel offers some very helpful thoughts about what people can do to keep PFAS out of their lives and bodies. You can find Rachel on Bluesky, Instagram and X and if you have a forever chemicals story of your own you can reach her at The Hill at rfrazin@thehill.com